Thanks so much for posting this. Its a pity Joseph Smith couldnt sit them all down for a good coming-to-Jesus admonishing. We also talk about the concept of translation, Joseph Smiths views on his translations, the traditional apologetic responses concerning the Book of Abraham (Hugh Nibley, John Gee, and Kerry Muhlestein), as well as the LDS Churchs recent essay on the Book of Abraham. Brent Metcalfe is definitely one of my favorite interviewees ever on Mormon Stories Podcast. Its great to find all this background information. He was enthusiastic about scholars allegedly validating his translations through secular methods (e.g., Charles Anthon on the BoMor characters and Michael Chandlers anonymous scholars on the BoAbr papyri). Fixed: Release in which this issue/RFE has been fixed.The release containing this fix may be available for download as an Early Access Release or a General Availability Release. In Part 3, Brent discusses the aftermath of the Hofmann murders, including the trial and Hofmanns eventual plea deal. Renaissance And Reform In Tudor England: The Careers Of Sir Richard OMAHA, Neb. Some people who study and read deeply can be more expert than others with advanced degrees. Coming! Does your wife and/or children? Copyright 2005 - 2023 | Mormon Stories. This has to be one of my top 10 favorite Mormonstories podcasts. Utah LDS Member Excommunicated By Eagle Mountain Stake - Blogger hillside christian church staff/ brent metcalfe excommunicated Create a Word Cloud at Tagxedo.Com. This is one that definately left me wanting more. [5][6], According to the Deseret News, the response from the apologetic community was "vitriolic. 52K views 2 years ago Iowa's Brent Metcalf took down Ohio State's Lance Palmer in a thrilling title bout at 149 pounds in the 2010 NCAA wrestling championships. I totally empathize with Brent, and all those who were condemned for their questions and knowledge seeking behavior. Iowa's Brent Metcalf wrestles with Iowa State's Mitch Mueller during their 149 pound match Friday, March 19, 2010 in the quarterfinal round of the 2010 NCAA Division 1 Wrestling Championships at . Why didnt the church just pay for their own documents? We were not suppose to discuss the Temple, Blacks and Priesthood, and of course definitely not curtain parts of the church history such as polygamy and polyandry. 100% CAUCASIAN Our ethnicity data indicates the majority is Caucasian. So sorry for the delay!!!! I do remember after my baptismal interview having a strong feeling of love and admiration for him because someone so respected thought I was special too. I still remember the demo you and your friends gave in the Rec Hall for Mutual. "Mark deceived everyone," Co-director Jared Hess told Deseret News. Im not sure why I would have been hesitant to answer the question during the interview since Ive addressed it numerous timesIll have to go back and listen. Also, the rest of your experience is so totally mind-blowing-interesting. After all, we are human! If you ever get the chance to talk with Steve Christensens wife and/or Brent Metcalfe again, I would like to hear you explore this dichotomy with them as they are polar opposites. but he threw out the baby with the bath water as if the success of Christianity rode on the success of Joseph Smith.. @BHMetcalf. And it leaves this distrust in LDS leaders hanging with the viewer. Is there a list of Mormon historians who were ex'd because of the He also discusses the events leading up to, and including, his excommunication. Steven Christensen (son of Mr. Mac), one of Mark Hofmanns victims. Trent Nelson | The Salt Lake Tribune Dorie Olds is the ex-wife of Mormon bomber Mark Hofmann, who killed two people on Oct. 15, 1985. Thank you so much for the story and the insights. Boy, what a chilling conclusion. Im sure this applies to other beliefs as well. at firesides, etc about some new discovery somewhere that was about to put to rest the concerns about the BOMs historicity. The insight into the many corners of Mormonism important to us here was delicious. I can hardly wait for the rest! Tom, have you considered allowing John to interview you? Brent is a fascinating interview for Mormon Stories for many reasons, including: He knew forger and bomber Mark Hofmann personally. Good clarification, Doubting Thomas (if that is your real name), :) I have no reason to believe that Jerald Tanner attempted official contact, so Im not sure who Darrick is referring to or what the method of communication entailed. Part 1 of the interview stuck much closer to home for me. Thank you Brent and John. Do you believe that your martial arts and mental training has contributed to your belief system and the independence from the crowd? I was pronouncing words instead of just reading them. The time has come to really dig in and discover our true human beginnings without religious bias. Your account of why you didnt pursue a doctorate was extremely touching to me as I absolutely admire those that can do the tedium of historical research. This is one of my all-time favorites. A special thanks to Brent for giving up so much of his time to do these episodes, especially some of them as he was feeling very much under the weather. Brent had some trouble remembering the details of the events (so did I, and I wasnt there, although I read all of the relevant literature at the time), but I think this is a very good summing up by Jerald Tanner, Confessions of a White Salamander: https://www.utlm.org/onlinebooks/trackingconfessions1.htm. As a personal friend and research assistant for both Steve Christensen and Mark Hofmann, Brent Metcalfe watched the whole episode unfold right before his eyes. It would have helped me a lot to know I was not alone. I hope to move on some day as well. If God will ultimately judge us all, why are mere mortals judging mortals, with the illusion of acting for God? My life has been enriched by theinquiries those books catalyzed. Hi, was wondering if Brent is still available to respond to my train of thought above? It is something that has fascinated me, and this Metcalfe interview did not disappoint!!! I have been thinking nonstop about that analogy, because it is so illustrative of the disorder. 10 of Brent Metcalfe Podcasts Interviews | Updated Daily - OwlTail And you are an example. As I went towards the house, this thought came into my mind, why do I feel so different from what I did a short time past : I am unspeakably happy and shall never see trouble again.. Is there going to be a part 3? Ack! I am so grateful I stumbled across them along with D. Michael Quinns books wow now 20 years ago. Over the years you just reason, that a faith shouldnt be that complicated. Brent Metcalf's Career Timeline - FloWrestling What a fascinating glimpse. They buried the Mclellin diaries also.similar thingdidnt like the content. He has also served in the United States Air Force (Air National Guard) since 2004. On my mission in England I met a older, wise non LDS woman very knowledgeable on esoteric and metaphysics teachings. Afraid that Brent would go public with the contradictory information, the LDS church terminated him as a member. accounting for llc member buyout; black barber shops chicago; otto ohlendorf descendants; 97 4runner brake bleeding; Freundschaft aufhoren: zu welchem Zeitpunkt sera Semantik Starke & genau so wie parece fair ist und bleibt 7 czerwca 2022. In this fascinating conversation Brent details that while working for Church security he was working on scholarly endeavors that he hoped would help contribute to apologitic defenses of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Thanks! This negative sentiment is perhaps made up for by Hofmann's victims. New Approaches to the Book of Mormon: Explorations in Critical Methodology, https://www.deseretnews.com/article/865608559/BYU-professor-speaks-on-unnoticed-assumptions-about-the-Book-of-Abraham.html. https://egyptianalphabetandgrammar.blogspot.com/. Im definitely a fan. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. [9] According to Metcalfe, he had written a letter to LDS Church leader Gordon B. Hinckley, disputing the grounds for his termination. I clearly remember the frustration in her voice. LDS was newly brought to her by a missionary before me. I had no idea what your beliefs were and it piqued my interest in part 1 where you talked about scripture being inspirational yet often times not historical. In these two episodes we discuss: 1) The aftermath of the Mark Hofmann bombings, and Brent's. Brent Metcalf vs. Lance Palmer: 2010 NCAA title match (149 pounds) So sorry Maxine! I have heard metaphysics mentioned in one of the interviews (I think it was the one on post declaration polygamy). brent metcalfe excommunicated Lessons learnt - Blogger According to Metcalfe, he was questioned by LDS Church authorities about his writing for the 7EP and Sunstone was "forced to resign" from his job in April 1983. I think youre referring to what has collectively come to be known as the Michigan Relics. James E Talmage wrote quite a bit about them, back in the day. Hearing Brent break down the Hoffman timeline and story was amazing. Once you start to deconstruct Mormonism, the next step is Christianity, and then the existence of a god, or not There are plenty of stops along that road to hang your hat, but the fastest growing belief system around the existence of god, is atheism. I felt like somehow I was responsible for what had happened. Download . Do you attend church anyplace else? From Spencer Kimballs battle with dementia to Monsons where the hell is that driver, to the insights with Mark E Peterson, Brents influential instructors at the University of Utah. Is having spiritual experiences while doing what some may view as critical research on the Book, when you know there may be opposing views to your work, grounds for also having these feelings? I have that info direct from Mac himself. I think we ought to be okay with these questions, and not automatically defensive. As an atheist I am not without my own inconvenient truths. They have shown time and time again that that is all that matters to them. Read More: Where is Terri Christensen Now? Ive always wondered if my church record was blighted in some way. Thank you, I didnt know about that info. Thank you so much for being so open and honest that particular issue. Published by on October 31, 2021. Hibbard later had a dream in which he again. I cant wait to listen to the second half! how to delete casting call club account - Rodel.xyz Examples would be projects at the Serpent Mounds in Ohio, linguists studying things like Native Americans singing in a language that seemed close to Hebrew,archaeological digs in latin America that were obviously BOM related, etc. Interested to hear about your mission, did you serve in Wandsworth at all? Released: Sep 13, 2014 Format: Podcast episode My faith failed me and that led to crisis. Those mind-opening essays impacted my life in positive and powerful ways. [] author and editor of numerous articles and two Signature Books titles, was interviewed by John Dehlin for the Mormon Stories podcast recently. Its very sunny in London today and Ive listened too all eleven hours of this interview. They claim that it occurred here in the USA siting scriptures and other things Joseph smith said. This doesn't mean that Metcalfe has accurately translated that theory into his study of things Mormon. Looking forward to the interview! See the next John Whitmer Historical Association Journal for one of my essays. Maxine Hanks was also in my ward. Metcalf served as the National Freestyle Developmental Coach prior to . Post-Vatican II a renaissance of sorts occurred in scriptural exegesis (for example, scholars no longer felt compelled to affirm the priority of Matthew and they began reassessing the synoptic gospels and John more critically). What advice does Brent have for aspiring Mormon historians? Reply. Life seemed euphoric until I was excommunicated from the church because I questioned and I researched. Growing up as a full believer, Brent followed the conventional routine and did the missions, after which he spent a lot of time in the historical archives of the Church, researching documents and working with the security department. I have heard that Mac Christianson financed the mission of one of Hofmanns sons. Hofmann really believed he could pull it all off, and maybe it wasnt just the police who thwarted his scheme? Many of the writers did become illustrious personalities, exactly as you point out. What do you attribute this decline to? Thank you Brandt for sharing your experiences. He did so to prevent members from apostatizing and becoming fundamentalists. Thanks for the great podcast. I remember one time a BYU professor handed me a long quote to read out loud to the class when I walked in and I almost had the first major public panic attack of my life. Simply put, I think JSs BoAbr project is an example of JSs *sincerity*, not his fraudulence. About a year or so ago when I finally left the church I looked him up to get advice and catch up on old times. Oh, that would be great! Arent we to try to gain understanding about life and spirituality? I dont agree with all the conclusions of your research but the research is a gift to all of us. The 7th East Press is one of the great university newspapers; truly the stars aligned when this group got together. What is your spirtuality/worldview like post-Mormonism? My mind was calm and at peace with God through the Lamb of God, that taketh away the sin of the world. No one believed that any one person could do all of those forgeries and build those bombs, and kill those people . So yes, Brent, please comment on this phenomenon. What is not to love about Johns revelation of your worthy biceps? Elbert was the managing editor, and Ron the financial guy, so I had the impression that Elbert created the whole thing. Doxey denied asking about Metcalfe. [9] When it became rumored that Metcalfe had lost his belief in the historical claims of the LDS Church, Christensen terminated the project and fired Metcalfe. Elbert once quipped, The Open Door Club has become the 7th East Press!. John, you asked for information about any of the Christensens. How did you encourage this masterpiece which, in my opinion, decimates the churchs past claims on the BofA? That said, I have to wonder what planet hes living on when he says that Catholicism has been reinvigorated in the post Vatican II era. You guys at MS are doing great. This one is up there with the best. Brent, Brent did Jerald make an official overture to church leadership regarding Hofmann being a fraud? I struggled in school with learning how to read for years and this resulted in me developing crippling anxiety any time I was aced to read in public. Its probably best to start over when these things happen, rather than just continuing where you left off. Why didnt Mr. Metcalfe publish his long-anticipated book disproving the Book of Abraham? Im glad you found some of my remarks useful and thanks for the kind comments. Jerald articulated his concerns in one of his ministrys publications. Talk about ADD. What an amazing story that Brent was a participant. As coincidence would have it, a few months later I became her home teacher. Im sure there is a very good possibility that COB personnel would have been more suspect of Jerald, and any information he offered, than Hofmann. Like I said they were casting that net as wide as they could get it. Brent Metcalf's Instagram, Twitter & Facebook on IDCrawl John Dehlin Faces Excommunication. What has been the ramifications to your excommunication among other family members? [9][4], After being fired from his job in security for the LDS Church for his writings, Metcalfe worked first for Steve Christensen and later for Mark Hofmann. Brent H Metcalf, 71 Resides in Salt Lake City, UT Lived In Sandy UT Related To Kyle Metcalf, Molly Metcalf, Kristy Metcalf, Nicole Metcalf Includes Address (3) Phone (4) Email (3) See Results Brent Charles Metcalf, 55 Resides in Lowell, AR Lived In Modesto CA, Oroville CA, Bonney Lake WA Also known as Gary Brent, Metcalf Brent I could read fine in private but the social damage was done and anxiety overwhelmed me every time. o David Wright was excommunicated for apostasy in April 1994 for his nontraditional views on Mormon scripture as exhibited in essays like his chapter in New Approaches to the Book of Mormon. She has become the matron saint of Mormon studies (that's a promotion from her previous role as the den mother of Mormon studies). This was an awesome interview. It shows how establishment Apologists from FAIR and Interpreter and the rest of the former FARMS crew only care about your academic achievements even if you actually do do serious research on the Book of Abraham. Come to the dark side and tell your story. You didnt elaborate on that interpretation. The full title is: The life, conversion, preaching, travels, and sufferings of Elias Smith. And great questions John. We should also mention that he has since been a key speaker at a conference hosted by Ex-Mormon Foundation and has given several interviews where he has detailed his lifes ups and downs. The Version table provides details related to the release that this issue/RFE will be addressed. All rights reserved. As soon as we can! He remains an enigma. This was an excellent broadcast! It would yield some satisfaction to me, if my misery can be a cause of happiness to others; but when I came to the place of prayer, had kneeled down, and closed my eyes, with my hands uplifted toward the heavens, I saw Jesus Christ at the right hand of God looking down upon me, and God the Father looking upon him. Roger that. Ive always wondered why the most ardently orthodox and pious seem to have the least faith in the divinity and omnipotence of the Lords plan. In episode #276 of The Jimmy Rex Show, we sit down with a key role in Netflix Documentary Murder Among The Mormons, Brent Metcalfe.Visit and Listen to more. Hope all is good with you. All this transpired in the 1980s, just around the time Mark Hofmann made his name in the community as a renowned book and document dealer. Brent Metcalfe on Hofmann aftermath, his own excommunication - reddit Do you know if the church took down the names of all the 7th East Press people? Learn how your comment data is processed. Thats not necessarily a problem, of course. brent metcalfe excommunicated - knowthemquicker.com Ive known many of Brents views (his liking Raymond Brown, etc.) Carl, in parts 3 & 4 of the interview, Ill discuss the BoAbr and some of the challenges that believing scholars face in analyzing its ideational and textual origins. fireside chat september 3, 1939 summary . But those were interesting times! Contributions. I was hoping you would have spoken more about the Book of Mormon and Abraham. (The audio starts in Part 1 around 1:23.55) I did a little research and found a digitized & searchable copy of Elias Smiths autobiography. I always enjoyed our discussions years ago about your love for the Indians in your mission and then your experience doing research with their culture and you feelings towards the Book of Mormon. If Catholicism were ultimately true, for example, then in the final accounting its dogmatic claims would not be hamstringing- they would serve as a clarifying lens through which to analyze historical questions, a lens which helps the believing scholar from wasting his time investigating a false path. And now, as per reports, Brent Metcalfe has been able to construct a healthy and happy life for himself outside of Mormonism, where he can continue to work as an independent scholar and technical editor without any issues or restrictions. In 1539 he was elected as an MP for the rst time and was appointed to serve in the King's Privy Chamber. Im curious who is singing Lead Kindly Light in this its beautiful. Gary at the time was an up-and-coming star because of his writing skills. I have question on the Book of Abraham. by Brent Metcalfe November 24, 2014 14 Comments Jan Shipps is the perfect inaugural interview for the Mormon Studies podcast. Did John take the tapes home to show his wife? Brent Metcalf in California - Spokeo Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. It seems like in the aftermath of the bombings, combined with his zeal to argue the history of Mormonism, Brent Metcalfe was excommunicated from The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. So cool that you provided some of the research used by Michael Quinn. Is there going to be a part 3? Really, such a great family. Azerbaijan's Jabrayil Hasanov in action against The USA's Brent Metcalf. As a personal friend and research assistant for both Steve Christensen and Mark Hofmann, Brent Metcalfe watched the whole episode unfold right before his eyes. Ive struggled to understand the human mind in this regard. Yes! I am quite sure, that film is no longer shown. John and I are just trying to align our schedules, so expect parts 3 & 4 soon. The Gift of the Mormon Faith Crisis Podcast. Near the end of a presentation you gave for the ExMormon Foundation, you said something to the effect of: People ask me how Joseph Smith wrote the Book of Mormon, how he pulled it off, how it all came about. Thanks, John and Brent! Davison wrestling family reflects on memory of the late Chase Metcalf I just got done reading the book Mormon murders. Metcalfe is on the editorial board of the John Whitmer Historical Association. Brent Metcalfe borrows the titles of a few works on literary and narrative theory and then concludes that such theory under mines the historical claims of the Book of Mormon. Fantastic interviews. Years ago, I attended a book reading and signing by Jon Krakauer in Marin County when he was promoting Under the Banner of Heaven. It seems to me that going with what you may think everyone around knows is right (even if it isnt) more easily allows for these kinds of experiences more than realizing there are differences of opinion and thought and then vying for spiritual confirmation. brent metcalfe excommunicated If I applied Vatican II to the full breadth of Catholicism, I clearly misspoke (Im not even sure why I would make such a sweeping claim, so I am a tad mystified). "The Mormon murders: A true story of greed, forgery, deceit, and death." Lex, the recommendation by Andrew is a good resource. On Wiwikipedia, it mentions that in a hit piece done by Dan Peterson, that he encodeds the message, Metcalfe is a butthead. What were your qurarrels like with FARMS? She was very impressed with the level of esoteric teachings in the D&C and Pearl of Great price. John Dehlin Faces Excommunication | Ploni Almoni Im with you on the music Charles!! And how many. Thank you for this very interesting presentation. Yes, because remember that the paradigm speaking through Mikes words is not just representative of him. Brent Metcalf - Wikipedia Please, God, let this podcast inspire someone to produce a talk show called, Hot-tubbing with Mark Hoffman! Books to Read | Recovery from Mormonism I have one teensy-tiny criticism about Johns sensitivity when someone questioned why Brent did not pursue an advanced degree. Thomas, I can assure you Im living on the same planet you are. Honestly, incredible work. St. Martins Press. [2][3], At first Metcalfe was placed on 30 days probation by the LDS Security department and ordered to "sever yourself from involvement with people, groups, or publications that teach doctrines, privately or publicly, which are contrary to those of the Prophet." 493-494; 497-499b: Brent Metcalfe - Mormon Stories Nicely done, John. We have to learn to get along and improve our conditions wherever we are and it is a much more difficult task because of all the varied belief systems prevalent in the world. Andrew, Joseph Smith dictated the story of princess Katumin and her regal father Onitas to his scribes Oliver Cowdery and William W. Phelps, who recorded the tale in two small notebooks. This is one of the best MS interviews I have heard so far. The LDS Church fired Brigham Young University professor David Wright for his contribution to the volume, and excommunicated both Wright and Metcalfe shortly thereafter. What do you think about the DCP/Hamblin FARMS implosion? So, based on Krakauers shared experience, it sounds like the answer is no, Hofmann doesnt do interviews. Research into the origins or Christianity strongly suggest that there are no babies only bathwater. Joseph Smiths myth-making leveraged Christian myth-making at the dawn of higher criticism. What historical issues does he think are most worthy of exploration, and how would he suggest young aspiring researchers go about gathering and parsing primary and secondary sources? They even go so far as to claim that Zarahemla was directly across the river from Nauvoo, and that the waters of mormon are Big Springs, MO.